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17 February 2013 @ 11:22 am
Can we discuss McMom?  
I don't want this to turn into Doris bashing but...really? I have some issues with this storyline. Issues, I tell you!

I don't particularly care about Doris being back. I mean, I hate what it's doing to Steve but it doesn't especially bother me in context to what it means for the show. Some people are hating on her like they hated on Lori - "she's useless" "she takes away from the main four" "blah blah blah."

What I object to is the amount of freaking time it's taking for her story to go anywhere. Seriously, writers of the show??? I get that not every episode can include Doris-exposition. The show isn't a serial /soap opera. Every story line can't be included in every show. But really? Get to the freaking point already! Answer these basic questions, please!!!!

1. Where does Doris sleep? In Steve's old room? In Mary's old room? How incredibly awkward would it be for Steve to have sex with Catherine in his mother's old bed when his mother is right down the hall in his old room? OMG. Just no.

2. What's the deal with McMom and Wo Fat? She didn't shoot him in the first (or second?) episode. Why do we have to wait this long to find out what their deal is??? Has she been secretly meeting with him? Is that why there are too many miles on the truck???

3. What about the fact that she tortured that dude? And Catherine didn't tell Steve? Seriously? What's going to happen when Steve finds out Catherine has been lying to him this whole time?

4. Did McDad know McMom was CIA? Did McDad know McMom faked her own death? (This may have been discussed in the show and I just can't remember.)

5. What about that microfilm McMom found? Surely it wasn't little Stevie in his camouflage footie pajamas like I (or possibly someone else) suggested?

6. What is the legal status of McMom? I mean, how does one come back from the dead? Do you go to the DMV and say "there was a mix-up"? "I'm not really and truly dead?" What about the house? It belonged to McDad and McMom until she "died". Then it belonged to McDad. Now we assume it belongs to McSteve. But does McMom have any legal claim to it? (Why do I overthink these things????)

Do you see?? There are too many loose ends that need to be tied up. And it's annoying me! (I guess you guessed that.) Wouldn't February sweeps have been the perfect time to start tying things up? Are we going to have to wait until the episodes reach the 20s before anything is revealed? Because that's going to require a lot of explaining in a short amount of episodes.

All right. Deep breath. This isn't that important, really. Breathe in and out. In and out.

Yep. I feel better now.
From a little spark may burst a mighty flamedante_s_hell on February 17th, 2013 04:44 pm (UTC)
Is it sad that I tend to ignore the Doris storyline? Seriously, she's a little to arrogant, haughty, and generally rude to me. Not to mention the hell she's put Steve and Mary through. I also tend to think that McDad had no idea she was still alive, but who knows what the writers will do on that score. Speaking of McDad, I'd love an episode where we get to learn more about him. Like maybe he solved a difficult case and the nut he put away escapes and Steve has to go after him.

I digress....

She's dead. The house belongs to Steve. She could probably "come back to life" legally, but I'm sure that would take a bit of paperwork and time. She also strikes me as the type to prefer to stay dead/under the radar.

I completely agree with you about #1.

I hate to think about what Steve would do when he finds out about Catherine lying. There's just not too many people he can trust. It'll hurt him. And I actually like Catherine. I kind of hope she sticks around for a bit.

Sorry for the long, wordy answer. You've given me a lot to think about. :-)
Are 6 dogs too many?: black widow busytkeylasunset on February 17th, 2013 08:21 pm (UTC)
Seriously, she's a little to arrogant, haughty, and generally rude to me. - yes to all of this!! I don't hate her like some people do, but she is not someone I want to spend quality time with.

I'd love an episode with more McDad too! Maybe the flashback episode with Steve in BUDs training will show some McDad?

Steve is going to be very disappointed when he discovers Catherine lied - if the writers ever address it. They do tend to not tie up all their loose ends. I guess that's what fanfiction is for, huh?

No no - no answer is ever too long!!! Sorry if I started you down a road you didn't intend to travel!!!

dreamwind83: Alex <3 Scottdreamwind83 on February 18th, 2013 01:57 am (UTC)
Seriously, she's a little to arrogant, haughty, and generally rude to me. - yes to all of this!! I don't hate her like some people do, but she is not someone I want to spend quality time with.

I agree with both of you. I think the actress is doing a great job of playing her, but I can't help but hate the character because of what she put her family through. She is arrogant, haughty and extremely bitchy. There really isn't any reason shown to trust or like her. They don't even really have a good explanation for why she faked her death.

I'd love an episode with more McDad too! Maybe the flashback episode with Steve in BUDs training will show some McDad? I would love that! That would be a great episode. I would love to see more flashbacks with McDad, because it doesn't seem like he had any idea his wife was CIA or that she was still alive. If he did then he would have had more information in the Champ box.

Steve is going to be very disappointed when he discovers Catherine lied That is an understatement. If you think about it the only people Steve trusts are Chin, Kono, Danny and Catherine. He doesn't have anyone else he can trust anymore. Joe completely broke Steve's trust and it's obvious that Steve wants to trust his Mother simply because she is his Mother, but doesn't actually trust her at all. If, when, Steve finds out what Catherine saw his Mother do, and hid that information from him...I think that would be the end of any sort of relationship between them. How could she explain to him that she saw his mother torture someone and hide all the evidence of it and not tell him? How could Steve trust anything else she tells him after finding out someone he trusts to sleep beside him, to work with him, to have his back! How can he trust her at all after that?

It's sad because i like Catherine. I think they wrote her better in season 1 than in 2 or 3, but I generally like her as a character. Until that episode. It ruined her for me forever. If I was Steve I couldn't ever forgive her. Does that make me a bad person?
Lizet Elainesimplyn2deep on February 17th, 2013 04:47 pm (UTC)
6. As far as we/I know, she's still legally dead...unless Steve and/or Joe put a rush to declare her alive. But whatever the case, as McDad's sole living relatives, the house would have more than likelt been willed to Steve and/or Mary. McMom could contest that I'm sure.

Will answer, or attempt to answer other questions later lol

1. As for if McMom is staying in the house...I wouldn't put it past her for guilting him into letting her stay in the house. They would both consider it to be a win/win situation. Steve thinking he can keep an eye on his mother and she thinking that she can snoop more around the house. she's got to have more things hidden than just film in the floorboard.

2. I'm betting Lenkov and the writers are going to bombard us at the end of the season (like maybe the last 5 episodes) with anything and everything Doris/Wo Fat related. We may get a resolution, and we may get more questions that may or may not be answered in season 4.

3. Going along with the above answer, I think this is also something that's going to be addressed in the last 5 episodes of the season. Knowing how much of a crush Peter has on Catherine, it might get pushed to the very last and we'll have to deal with it in season 4 - though I hope not!

4. I don't think John knew the real Doris. I wonder if she went to Joe with some story, possibly the truth, and asked for help, then asked Joe not to tell John. Hmm sound familiar?? She got caught by Catherine doing something not good then asked her not to say anything to Steve!

5. She probably has more secrets hidden around that house. like I said in #1, she's probably searching them all out and getting them out and to a safe location. They could be her insurance policies and I don't mean medical, dental, but life. She's got information on all sorts of people and she'll probably need it to keep herself safe

I think the last 5 episodes, if not more, are going to be devoted to trying to wrap this all up, but with as little movement that direction as we've had in the last 16 episodes, I don't know how that's going to play out for the rest of the season.

Edited at 2013-02-17 06:09 pm (UTC)
Are 6 dogs too many?: Cap Americatkeylasunset on February 17th, 2013 08:25 pm (UTC)
1. So you think it was her decision to live in the house? I really don't know how Steve can stand having her there. He doesn't trust her! And you're probably right - she's busy digging up other secret treasure troves!

2. I know there will be a cliffhanger at the end of the season - there always is. I guess making it McMom and Wo Fat is as good as any. Although it will be extremely annoying to have to wait!

3. Yeah, you're probably right!

4. I don't think John knew the truth either. If he had, would he have sent Steve and Mary away? That wouldn't make sense. But then it may be too much to ask to expect all this to make sense, huh?

5. I hadn't thought of that but you are probably exactly right!!

6. Being dead has its advantages. But it makes it hard to have a checking account! How do you buy groceries when you're dead??? Bwhahahaaa....
Azziria: h5-0azziria on February 17th, 2013 04:50 pm (UTC)
I've kind of felt that we haven't had anything to move that story arc along for a long time (especially when you think about how much stuff we got with Joe White etc last season). We seem to have had a run of very 'standalone' episodes without much background story arc. I've been wondering, though, if it's because they changed the episode order around so much - things haven't aired in the order originally planned, and maybe that's bumped some of the 'filler' episodes up the order, and we're now going to get a run of angsty background arc episodes.

Or perhaps, of course, they've taken on board how many people didn't like too much Shelburn etc last season and have focused more on the case-of-the-week type episodes this season. Only time will tell, I suppose.
Are 6 dogs too many?: enemy minetkeylasunset on February 17th, 2013 08:27 pm (UTC)
Exactly - the storyline is stalled! It probably does have something to do with changing the episode order. I did think there was way too much Shelburne last year - again, so many questions and so few answers. But don't introduce all these questions about McMom and not answer any of them!!!

I guess time will tell!
--♫ Anna--: Steve at Gov's officerocsfan on February 17th, 2013 05:01 pm (UTC)
I just don't like her because she's so rude and selfish. Yeah, Steve hired a PI to follow her, but she didn't have to be so unfeeling in the way she let him know she found out. I think he was justified in not asking her, given that he can't trust her at all.

Never thought about the sleeping arrangements! That would be awkward!

Somewhere we learned that McDad was not in the fake death. He went to his grave thinking she'd been gone for years. (I think it was in Steve's first conversation with her, in Japan) As far as I know, we've never learned if he knew about her CIA work.

I've wondered, too, how she just goes back to a "normal" life. I would guess that she doesn't care about the house, since she's focused on some kind of secret work. No idea how that would work legally, though. It also bugs me how she just goes about life: vistiing friends on Oahu, getting her nails done, etc.

I've also wished they would get back to her mystery! What is between her and Wo Fat? What's with that film? Give us something!! I think, like azzira said, part of it could be the episodes out of order and all the complaints about too much Shelburne last season. But personally, I need something more about her mystery!! I thought we might get something in this last one, but the PI didn't find out anything.

I still have a feeling that Steve/Cath is going to be a big blow-up once he finds out she's hiding that secret. I suppose the longer it goes on, the more of a blow-up it will be.
Are 6 dogs too many?: glad to see your backtkeylasunset on February 17th, 2013 08:30 pm (UTC)
She is rude and selfish, isn't she? I mean, seriously. What are her redeeming qualities?

It makes a lot more sense for McDad not to know she had faked her death.

It also bugs me how she just goes about life: vistiing friends on Oahu, getting her nails done, etc. Yes this!! You were dead for 20 years. How do you have friends left to visit???

I want to get back to the Wo Fat mystery too - to get a resolution on it!! Enough with the mysteries already.

I think Steve and Cath are going to have a big blow-up. They'll break up then Steve and Danny will start dating. Oh wait. That's just inside my head - sorry!
kaige68: SC sockskaige68 on February 17th, 2013 05:52 pm (UTC)
McMom - *sigh*

1) I think that if you fake your death and dissappear for 20 years, then make Joe White lie to your son for at least a year and make him crazy to solve the mystery, THEN decide you're going to tell him your alive but rather than show up at his door you're going to make Joe bring your son to you so that you can go back home - you don't get to call which bunk you want. In my mind she sleeps in which ever room is furthest away from Steve's. Also you should replace your mattress every 8 or so years, so I'm going to think that it's a little be removed from being the McParents' bed. Sorry, I'm feeling long winded today.

2) I would like to get the plot moving along a bit more, however I also don't want to be beaten over the head with SHELBUUUUUUUUUUUURNE! like plots. In all honesty, I tend to forget about her until she on the screen and then it's all "Oh, this bitch." I'll just keep my fingers crossed that we get a little further along soon.

3) I like Catherine, and I don't really feel that she had a whole hell of a lot of choice. While Catherine might be Bad Ass, Doris is SCARY Bad Ass." Plus, Catherine is not completely absolved of fibbing to Steve, cause she was hiding the WitSec guy in her kitchen when Steve stopped by. I do think it's going to blow up and it's only going to mean more pain and doubt for Steve.

4) In my head canon I like to think that McMom is duplicitous since childhood. I think she met McDad and thought "Here's a dupe who believes I'm a schoolteacher! I can quit the CIA!" Ok, so maybe she's not as smart as I give her credit for being. But yes, I think she duped the McFamily and McFriends.

6) WitSec! I would think she's still dead. We know from the making Catherine keep her secret episode that WitSec is still interested in Doris and even though WoFat knows she's alive she would still need to be under protection. They probably gave her papers saying that she was Doris McFerrett, thus the house is still Steve's and she has a govt issued drivers license.

7) You do over think things! I LOVE IT!!! GO YOU!!!
a geek in such the wrong way: H50-steve-nutshaldoor on February 17th, 2013 06:01 pm (UTC)
Wow. I have so much going on in my head already, so I don't tend to think so much about the show. (Why yes, I am shallow. Is Steve hot this week? Yes! Doris who?) Plus, American shows disappoint me time and again over storylines, so I never expect much. As for reality - they never address people needing to pee when they're kidnapped; you seriously think they'll tell us where Doris is sleeping? Also, they imply there's only two bedrooms or something - like so many shows - when we know there's at least THREE. There's room. With her being 'dead' for 20 years, one assumes she now has another passport (how else would she get around) and papers in a whole other name, so Steve & Mary own the house and she's just a (non-paying) guest. BTW, she annoys me too - no one should be so smug, but honestly, that last ep? Steve and Treat (no, don't remember chara names) were pretty slack in their 'cover job'; how could she not realise they knew each other? The chat at the door, DUH!!!

And that's my two cents worth! ;-)
stellarmeadow: steverainbowstellarmeadow on February 17th, 2013 07:49 pm (UTC)
I think azz may have a point about the moving around of episodes--could've caused it to be more unbalanced than originally intended.

I am really fascinated by this storyline and would like to see some movement on it, too. I get that they took the feedback on too much Wo Fat arc time last season to heart, but maybe swing the pendulum a bit back towards center again. I like the character potiential this storyline, and I can't wait to see the fallout of him learning Catherine lied to him. I like her, I just am really looking forward to the Steve angst because I like Steve angst...what can I say? :)

About Doris's room - according to a friend who's been in the Bayer Estate, the master bedroom is actually the one that overlooks the back yard/ocean. Steve sleeps in one off to the side, which I'm assuming was his room when he was growing up.
landrewslandrews on February 17th, 2013 10:32 pm (UTC)
I'm on my way to re-read reading your "Comedy of Errors" and leave a comment on the second bit , which I failed to do because of RL distractions... y'know :-), but got waylaid by this post :-)

1) When parents not being in house is not an option, the sehx happens anyway, lolol. Quietly. Mostly. Steve buys new furniture, at least new bedstead (and, I'd assume, mattress) sometime between the tsunami ep and the ep in which he storms out of bed because Danny still has the TV going at early 'o'clock in the am. Check it out! You can tie things to the new headboard :wagglesbrows: I think that comment above that Steve's in his old side room is interesting. I'll have to zoom back through and see why the poster thinks he's not overlooking backyard/ocean. Also, as us Angel fans know, the exterior/interior RL locations really means shit all for figuring out fictional set-up of interior/exterior, lolol. I totally mean NO offense with that comment.

2) I hope we find out! Also, wondering how fucked up the ep order has ended up being, even at the writing stage, since 6-7 eps in, they already knew CBS was gonna fuck with the ep order. So far, ongoing story lines have all been cock-eyed time-wise in my opinion. Not how I'd pace it at alllll. But I also don't know what I'd offer as a writer once the network started screwing around and I KNEW it was gonna all look FUBAR. Probably wait until last five eps, like simplyn2deep says.

3) See previous answer. Why was she even there this week? Wasn't she being deployed again and that's why Steve tuxedoed a couple of eps ago? What order is this supposed to be in?

4) I also can't remember if it was addressed in canon, but I'm thinking, no, he didn't know. OTOH, it was his car Adam's uncle lit up and how did she escape? Um.... maybe the answer has to do with why she and WoFat obviously know each other and are mutually unwilling to waste the other? Hello, Steve's bro, OR hello, WoFat's CIA planted stepmom???

5) Lolol. No, definitely not. But, really, no one discovered the very obvious floor trap after McDad's murder? Maybe McSteve (or Danny) hired an 'After Disaster' service after the crime scene was released so Steve really never found it? He's not home but a few hours a day, probably doesn't spend much time in that room and so actually may not have washed that throw rug in two years. Maybe he has a maid service? I'm thinking I need to ask my Mom how often she washed a similar rug in a similar room in a house we lived in for three years.... Reminds me of a book rec: Untouchable by Scott O'Conner :-)

6) a) WitSec has some pull there, and the CIA, I'm assuming. Are they providing her some income or is Steve footing her existence? She hasn't purchased her own car, obviously. She's driving his truck if he's tracking odometer. Don't mess with a man and his Chevy, lolol. http://lawandthemultiverse.com/2010/12/05/im-not-dead-yet-resurrection-and-probate-law/ is interesting for the legalities of returning from the dead, courtesy of little_details. Couldn't get the a href coding to work :-/

Tres annoying!!!!!!! ITA!!

ETA: :hugs: haldoor That's all I'm watching for, bebe! AoL looks good with weight on, DDK knows how to wear his jeans, they aren't shorting GP on her BAMF scenes, and SC's scruff with the two little points of grey? Rowwrr :-)

Edited at 2013-02-17 10:38 pm (UTC)
dreamwind83: Alex <3 Scottdreamwind83 on February 18th, 2013 02:13 am (UTC)
Um.... maybe the answer has to do with why she and WoFat obviously know each other and are mutually unwilling to waste the other? Hello, Steve's bro, OR hello, WoFat's CIA planted stepmom???

Can I say I love you? That is totally my head cannon since we found out Steve's Mom was alive, that she could have killed Wo Fat but didn't and that she worked for the CIA. As did Wo Fat. So I completely believe that they are trying to lead us in the direction that Wo Fat is her son from some former CIA op. Maybe she was Wo Fat's father's handler? Why else would the writer's have her as a CIA agent and have Wo Fat working for the CIA as well.

Also, on a side note, what happened to the CIA trying to silence Danny on their whole corruption thing? He could totally take them down because of what they did to him and what he learned, and they are just going to leave him be? I have been waiting all season to see the CIA try to take him out. Of course I've also been waiting since season 1 for them to bring back Matt. So this will probably be another lose end they never bother to tie up.
Kathy: McDanno/fishingkitmerlot1213 on February 17th, 2013 11:19 pm (UTC)
These are all excellent questions, particularly the one about which bedroom Doris is sleeping in, what is her legal status and what exactly did Papa McG know about his wife.

I guess maybe when May sweeps rolls around we will find out more about the microfilm and how this is all connected to Wo fat.